Fuck WordPress.

But why?

@Treighton Becuase it's shit

@nblackburn eh, Its not that bad and if implemented well can actually be pretty awesome. Check this https://ustwo.com/blog/...

There are is a ton you can do with it, and it provides a great, simple dashboard for nontechnical people to keep manage their site...

Working with it can be kinda whacky, and there are a lot of shitty plugins and themes, but at the e d of the day it works, and is super popular...

@Treighton Popular !== good

It's popular because it was first and has been bent to it's will to be something it's not.

The code is a sham and a fucking disgrace to developers.

The only reason it is relevant is because agency's haven't finished milking dry that sweet crusted teet.

@nblackburn it definitely has been bent to be more than a blogging platform. And the code is pretty whacky...

I wouldn't say that it's "Good" or "shit", but I will say that in most cases for client work the benefits out weigh the negatives

@Treighton It's easy for clients but so are the 5000000000000999000884747372747473828384482929 alternatives.

@nblackburn what do / would you recommend to a client that requests WordPress as a CMS?

@Treighton

It's just so bulky to use. And absolutely no fun.

@Treighton I would take the time to explain that WordPress has been largely driven by hype and you would be much better choosing something else as there are better, more modern solutions that can get you want for cheaper and quicker.

I would talk though their requirements, show then some alternatives and see where we stand.

@deity @nblackburn I agree that WordPress is weird, but so are slot of CMS' Im not partial to WordPress but I've learned to work with it, and make good money doing it...

I don't think it's well suited for all projects, but for a lot of them it is.

@Treighton I used to work with it and it was the misery of my life. I build web applications from scratch now and am much happier.

@nblackburn from scratch scratch or with an app framework? In most cases building a custom CMS for every client seems ridiculous to me, but I have for certain clients used Django, Drupal, dotnetnuke, and slot I have talked out of having a CMS at all and just using a static site generator...

@Treighton As web app developers the cycle is much slower so you aren't farting out websites every day (like i was).

And we use frameworks but minimal ones; not ones that offer the kitchen sink.

@nblackburn I used to hate it when I first started working with it, but then I started finding little ways to make my life better like using twig templates, using composer, node (in dev), even in some cases completely decoupling the front end, etc. In a lot of cases I barely interact with any WP code...A d just let leverage the benefits of having it as a CMS...

Try Elixir/Phoenix

@codesculptor i love elixir but I can't use it. Client wants WordPress. I typically code my own.

@nblackburn yeah... if I had more time / budget i would not use WP, would definitely just build solutions from the ground up...

But...If it don't make dollas then it don't make sense 😎 (that being said I do feel like I've hit a ceiling of sorts working for an agency that insists on using WordPress for every project that comes through the door)

Curious what is your typical tech stack looking like on a usual basis?

@deity so change your customer lol

@Treighton I build everything API first usually with Node or Php and Vue on the frontend.

@nblackburn very glad I don't also defend PHP 😉

@Treighton PHP is great but hugely underrated.

@nblackburn I concur.

Most redundant comment on devRant. Fuck Wordpress. We know that feel bro!

@mk3d haha didn't realize that but I had to yell at someone! Can't very well tell the person sitting next to me :)

#WordpressMustFall

@nblackburn I agree.

Every now and then we hear this from someone and it is not unexpected.

WordPress encourage bad code practices.

"Write code for your later self and for your co-workers in the first place - not for the machine" - Unknown

😎 y'all keep hating, I'll be over here with all the clients that want WordPress...

@Treighton The #rant had to come out. Safer here than my site. :)

@krishna126 I do agree that it encourages bad practices, but that in itself can encourage diligence and help you build good habits (if you want to have e good clean portable PHP that could be repurposed in a different PHP application) I had to learn this the hard way, because I learned most PHP working at a WordPress/magento sweat shop, then started looking at other apps and realized I knew shit about anything...I still have a ton of room for improvement...But know I can write shit code and having to make the choice to write good code I feel has made me better at my job

@deity if want to see some crazy shit...Spin up a magento site and start going the some of their themes and plugins...😌

@Treighton ha - well when I'm looking for punishment I'll be sure to check it out.

@deity but even that being said you can write good code on top of a poorly coded platform 😉

@Treighton you're right. Most of the PHP devs (including myself 😁) Start with WP, learn other new framework and got to know what's wrong in WordPress. 😎

WordPress I really hate that postmeta table. My project I have 100k records.. Even if you improve your code, dB structure will screw you.

I'm pretty probably the only one here, but I like it

@Letmecode Mention cheaper and getting it done quicker and they will be more supportive.

They wont care about performance or security.

@Letmecode You need to give them the confidence both in you and to see that it's a good move.

It's a hard thing to get right but your clients will love you for it.

@Letmecode I know you're not, it's a challenge for the best of us.

Just a friendly bit of advice is all, not trying to be condicending at all.

Is it bad that I don't understand what word press is?..

@Treighton FUCK WORDPRESS. WASTE MY TIME TO LEARN. FUCK. RUBBISH. POPULAR <- FUCK. THAT's WORD WASTED MY LIFE.

Yeah WP can be total shiet. Sometimes it works fine other times it's a 1970s Fiat that's always in the shop. Definitely keeps devs busy. But honestly, I hate Drupal 10X10^6 more.