FOR FUCKS SAKE PEOPLE ! JS AND PYTHON ARE NOT THE BEST LANGUAGES NOR THE ONLY THING YOU SHOULD LEARN. THERE'S NO TOOL OUT THERE THAN CAN FIX EVERYTHING.

WTF HAPPENED TO THIS INDUSTRY IT'S AS IF JS AND PYTHON ARE ALL THEY TEACH THESE DAYS ...

ENOUGH ! BE A POLYGLOT OR GTFO (OR YOU CAN SPEAK ONLY 1 LANGUAGE AND STOP FORCING IT WHERE IT DOESN'T BELONG)

now that that's out of my system. bring it on

Y u so mad bruh. I like js and python

you like them, i kind of like them too. but they are not the only things to learn. i have a huge problem with people especially recent grads that know nothing but js or python and propose to do everything using them. if you're not willing to learn more at least​ stick to where js and python belong

whoa!....someone did piss you off with the most practiced method using js and python

@Tychus

@Kro9k actually yes. almost everyone i talk to my age knows nothing but js / python and pushes it everywhere.

Me: hey let's do this
X: oh that's interesting there's a js / python framework / lib for that.
-_- it's like no one cares about performance nobody knows about low level stuff cache misses, architecture ...

" optimization ? ah we have powerful machines and lots of memory plus the VM/interpreter will take care of it"

good programmers know more than 1 tech speak more than 1 language and most importantly know where each belong the pros cons and limitations of each of them. a good programmer is always interested in learning new things.

if all you want to do is js or python by all means go ahead but please don't be an idiot and push it everywhere.

it's becoming a religion or even a cult.

i agree ... that just makes people into boxes...
soundproof boxes..that can't listen to anything other than what's inside the box @Tychus

A good dev need to know one soft type lang, one strong typed, one functional, one procedural, and one object oriented.
oh, and assembler.

i kind of overdid the whole box dialect here .. :) @Kro9k

I actually agree, i really like python when I'm writing smallish scripts / testing things like email functionality (Google python SMTP server it's awesome) bit would i write a full scale system in it, probably not. These languages have there place but i don't think that place is in your system architecture spec - my two cents

Finally someone says what we're all thinking!

Js is not a programming language. Its a scripting language.

@provector aaaand a scripting language is a programming language

@Tychus then write me a desktop app in bash.

Languages are tools we use in our trade, there are a lot of different tools that all do the same thing.

https://devrant.io/rants/296000/...

@provector look it up all scripting languages ARE programming languages.
the definition of a programming language is not " a language used to make desktop apps".

back in the days we had no desktop apps hell we didn't have any desktops at all.

Definitely agree with...People should use C for everything.

@provector well I have not built a desktop app in bash but I did build a multithreaded mail server mostly in bash.

Of cause it used the mysql client for sql queries and a simple smtp sender for the actual sending of each email to the smtp server but all logic for fetching info and updating back into the sql was done in bash through use of background tasks and pipes ;)

But we replaced it will one built in C for better performance after a few months.

That's why my school started with Java and C#, because it's easier to work down in complexity than up from an easier language. That and it makes it just so much easier to pick up new languages. ~ 22yo newbie dev here.

@darkness yeah bro totally let's make a web app in C woohoo

Maybe you have to give them time to see beyond Python and js. The more you code, the more you want to do, and the more you have to learn. Don't be mad with those who only speak one language, eventually they'll have to move on.

@stereohisteria the annoying thing about it is that they are becoming more and more arrogant with a sense of superiority you can't even reason with them anymore.

I AM NOT ANGRY. I agree, one should pick the tech that suit the problem the best, and not the technos they knows the best.

@provector

Slack, Visual Studio Code, Discord, Atom... are a few javascript desktop apps.

Netflix, LinkedIn, Uber, etc all run javascript backend code on their servers.

If Javascript is a scripting language, so are PHP, Python and Ruby. I think "interpreted" is the word you're looking for...

...although most interpreter engines (including Chrome/NodeJS V8) compile the code before executing it anyway, so the lines keep blurring more and more.

Of course, fully pre-compiled programs in C, Rust or Haskell are faster... (btw, have you tried making a desktop app from scratch in those languages?)

@Tychus I think that superiority feel comes from the way python is presented to the newbies. Every tutorial or webinar tells you python is "the programing language which can do everything that every other languages does, but much more simple and easy to learn.
And that's not true, because things in programming are not so simple as the language you choose. Am I rambling nonsense here or do I make some point?

My school barely taught any Python or JS
Half of everything was in C/C++, and a few other HLLs. Plus some assembly!

@Tychus My company made an entire backend for microservices using Python and Scala with no architecture design or documentation...

I'll give you first choice of weapons but the boss is mine ;)

@stereohisteria
All I know is python really. I can't keep several languages straight in my head..

When looking into a language to learn, i choose python purely because it was simple, and as you said, everyone advertises it as the "end all" language.

I should of learned C# IMO. - But Python is fine. ^~^

@stereohisteria
The language choice you make should be based on the project at hand.

Things tend to get complicated as the project grows anyway... No point tripping over the lang along the way.

If someone put a gun to my head and forced me to pick an all-in-one, simple to use language it'd be Java not Python.

@antonis179
Well, I'm building a hacking game.. 4k lines in. Pure Python ATM, but going to support modding through Lua after we hit the Beta.

@antonis179
Pretty fast for me. No loading times at all.

@Cyanite I fucking love Python. That's the true. But I had to start using Perl and bash in administration tasks, because some programs, groups or even system features use it. Not to mention C and Php...
The thing is, it's fine to be a fanboy, but would be nice to have in mind that everyone who claims their way is the best may end up in the Apple side of the conversation. Just imagine how annoying can be an Apple fanboy but using Js o python instead of Mac or OSX

@stereohisteria
I just don't have the brain power to learn a bunch of languages.

@Cyanite No shame in getting really good with one language first.

A good way to broaden your horizon is to use a something new in the language you're familiar with: use a database for storage so you familiarize yourself with some sql, write a simple & small remote API in a different language so your app can sync data, write a super basic "companion" app for your phone, etc.

Once you are comfortable with 2-3 languages, new syntaxes become much easier to understand, and you discover new ways to do things in favorite language. So it really is worth it!

@Cyanite I suppose that's only a matter of time. I don't even speak a good python, but I have to work, so I try to keep up for the task

@bittersweet
I'm having to learn Lua for my game. It's mostly the same, but it's still new to me. Might expand more into the future. ^~^

@Cyanite the long road to Ada...

Here is what I believe, if your target machine is powerful enough, you should not reinvent the wheel either. JS, Python or Java has tons of library already doing a great amount of stuff for you. Now if you want to have fun to start from the scratch and optimise the shit out of it that's fine. But I believe if it is already out there for you, there's no point of doing it again when you're rapidly developing something.

Just my two cents.

@provector you realize scripts are programs right?

@tahnik maybe you're right, not everyone has to know everything. But I strongly believe that "reinventing wheels" is the way of humans to progress.

Bash and Python are all I need to find known vulnerabilities on your shiny application.

I know (something, not all) about low level programming in C and ASM, I also know a bit about Java, c#, PHP and js and I know a lot of Python. And after all this I think right now (in the most project, there are exceptions oc) the most important thing is not that your program runs fast, the most important thing is that your program go out fast to make money before the market time windows goes away, and there is where Python and js bright, in Python you can do almost anything faster than in any other language (In programming time) and also with the whole bunch of libraries out there most of the time you only have to get pieces together, js is a little bit the same but more code and less readable. Also, if your Python program needs a lot of optimization you could do a C library with Python's bindings. Just my opinion

@magicMirror I think C C++ haskell NASM covers them all, I believe they are not enough for web though (apart from WebAssembly ;) ) so the argument is not fully valid. However if you know these it'd be incredibly easy to learn any other language..

Sounds like you didn't read their resume before they were hired.

And their new grads.

Maybe STFU and empower them to contribute and give them time to learn.

ok you say we need practice C to make nodejs addons and python modules. whatever.

@FuzzyMyztiq I can't empower some one refusing to learn anything new or even try to have a conversation can i ?

@tahnik you don't have to always reinvent the wheel but you always have to understand the wheel. anyway my point is people need to understand that no matter how easy and powerful js and python are they are not and will never be the only thing you need to know. yes i know some people are not willing to go deep and they focus on one thing and that's fine but they should understand that it doesn't mean everyone should do the same

@Tychus i think everyone has that for a little while, just graduated you think you can take on the world. 6 months later you realise you can just about tie your own shoes in the real world

@vanhoosr You had a good school!

@daarkfall I think it's mostly due to how people are over hyping these technologies. all that " js is taking over the industry " " python is the best and easiest language and it's all you need to learn " " the web is taking over the world " " the future is the web " ... all these claims sound idiotic to me but unfortunately lots of young devs are falling for this bs we still need to have people working on the low level i mean how the fuck do you think you got those blazing fast routers, switches, how do you think drivers and operating systems are designed how do you think you're getting weather forecast everyday ? javascript ? hell no. it's thanks to a bunch of guys still rocking that " old low level complex crap ".

they should start telling people that programming is not only about cool looking ui and fancy web sites. that's only one career option in a sea of other options AND there are no silver bullets. teach them to not only learn to use a tool but also WHY and WHEN.

I love Python, but I can relate to the rant soo much !

@Tychus you're probably right but in a sense this sort of stuff is needed from more traditional communities to attract that level of attention to low level programming. Python in its defense is doing that through things like Raspberry pi's. It's difficult to teach things like C/asm when all people have ever used are higher level languages because of safe gaurds et al. Which to a degree don't exist in C hence these languages are trying to reach audiences which already know them and people think you can do everything in them.

DID YOU REALISE THAT ALL (most) YOUR LETTERS ARE IN CAPS

@krishnac7 he did it intentionally.

So did i @ragnarr023

@krishnac7 HE WAS YELLING BRO!!!!

Oh sorry that was louder than I expected.

Amen.

AND YOU STILL DIDN'T GET I DID THERE! woah yeah you are right,it was bit loud @brettmoan

Flame City up in here... "C++ one language to rule them all!" **Flies away**

@RYPTAR +1!

C++ after C++11 is truly the best, given the level of support it has on damn near every platform now.

@Tychus I know a C++ grad that refuses to learn anything else.

When all you have is a hammer.

My hammer happens to be JS and python, his is C++, same shit, different asshole..