Fucking tired of hearing the hatred against php. When I began learning php , i didnt know how unpopular it has became and now i' m in the middle of learning laravel, and i see people saying php is not even worth programming in. 😣

People hate it just because a lot.of successful sites have used it. If it weren't so popular, it wouldn't be so hated.

PHP hate comes from the stupid function naming, argument parsing orders and lack of forced coding styles.

PHP lets you do what ever you want as long as it can execute your code.

Now that in its self is great but can lead to the worst codebases known to mankind.

@C0D4 aka WordPress

@paulwillyjean
I try not to name that heap of putrid.

Although WP as a basic site I can live with, it’s the thousands of plugins that inject what ever they want where ever they want that gets me.

Having used PHP for almost a decade, I can totally see where people are coming from when they say it's a badly designed language (I think this article sums it up fairly well: https://goo.gl/enAk1X). As @C0D4 said, there's a lot of inconsistency in the language implementation itself that annoys pretty much everyone - I often have to refer to my IDE to find out which order I'm supposed to pass the arguments for, which you really shouldn't need to do.

Having said that, that's kinda what frameworks have been trying to resolve. If you can find a good framework that lets you programme well, you don't notice these issues quite as much. Possibly this isn't what frameworks should be for, but meh - if you can make good apps with a good framework, at the end of the day who cares? It's still a pretty powerful and common language,.

I'm also tired of people blaming a language for the things created with it. Just because you *can* do something in a language doesn't mean you *should*. Stop blaming the language for poor programmers. If you need a safety net, don't use a dynamic language.

If you’re cool with supporting legacy stuff you’ll probably end up making more money than all the haters. But, you either die a lover of a language or live long enough to see yourself become a hater.

@devios1 nailed it.

Laravel is good, PHP is good, as long as you code cleanly.
Anyway, the statement above can be applied to other technologies/languages, too.

Every language under the sun is both shit and insecure or fantastic and secure, given the wrong/right developer.

At the end of the day they all have strengths and weaknesses, and it requires a real developer to know these and then determine based on the development requirements which language is best suited.

While you can use a hammer ot knock in a screw, does not mean you should.

Someone has to maintain all that legacy code :p

Seriously, PHP is still used everywhere. Do you want free hosting? I'll give you some. Post your email.

Don't worry, most of the php haters are from people that use node, so think they are cool.

Php7 + a nice framework is bliss

Well, in my local area 99% of the web dev jobs are with php. I don't know anything about how unpopular it is :P

(And Laravel is great!)

and the hate is justified

https://eev.ee/blog/2012/...

(i am officially considered a PHP seniorin my country, so... not sure if that speaks to my high skill or my country's low standards, probably kind of both. and i agree with everything in that article)

@neodite Quite a few of which came from PHP to Node

@Midnigh-shcode That article just makes me love PHP more, with all of its weird little quirks, and lowers my respect of the author who frankly comes off as a whiny bitch. Luckily I didn't bother to find out who wrote it so no harm done.

Honestly though, while a lot of these are valid points and I wouldn't disagree with most of them, most of them are awfully nitpicky and solved by just learning that's how it works in PHP. The same thing could be said for JavaScript. It's more a factor of the age of the language than anything else. When you're designing a modern language from scratch you have the luxury of doing things however you want. But when a language evolves over a long period of time it's very different. The longevity and relevance of PHP after *22 years* should say something.

To me, PHP's shortcomings pale in comparison to its strengths: power, dynamism, tolerability and reliability. Not to mention ubiquity. It may not be a pretty language, but it has a certain inner beauty.

…also what was with the jab at Canada in there? As a Canadian I kind of take offense at that, but also as a Canadian I'm polite so I will just shrug it off.

@devios1 you sound precisely as an example of the bad influence PHP has on coders

@Midnigh-shcode I'm sorry, do you want to explain yourself before I jump to conclusions over what you meant by such a comment?

@Midnigh-shcode Well I've been programming for close to thirty years and I've learned a lot of languages. I think I've earned the right to decide which ones I like and which I don't.

PHP hasn't had a bad influence on me. If a language coerces me into doing things in a way I don't like, I stop using that language. That's why I won't program in Java.

You should stop seeing the language as dictating how the programmer uses it. Instead of thinking of PHP as a hammer, think of it like a multitool that has way more features than you'll ever need. Just because it has those features doesn't mean you have to use them, and it doesn't mean that it's not still useful when only a subset of those capabilities is used.

PHP has a lot of bad concepts in it that I consider harmful and will never use; extract() is a perfect example.

But just because the language has that capability doesn't mean that I'm necessarily a poorer programmer because of it.

And I know enough to know the difference.

@Midnigh-shcode I'll say it again: stop blaming the language for shitty programmers.

The whole point of programming is that you can literally do anything you can imagine, or should be able to. That puts a lot of responsibility on the programmer to know wtf they're doing and do it right.

You can write shitty code in any language. If your argument is that the language should limit the damage that can be done by poor programmers so that you don't have to inherit shitty codebases, all I can say is have fun working with those languages because I know I won't be.

@devios1 language doesn't dictate how a programmer uses it? really?
functional vs query vs oop, as the most substantial examples?
static vs dynamic typing? etc?

@devios1 i think i expressed my argument pretty well. you misinterpreting it is... well... you not letting my text dictate to you how you should interpret its meaning.

let's end this useless exchange, before it becomes full-blown fight, okay? have a nice day :)