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@dontPanic thanks. I feel sorry for me too.
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@DeadInside you deserve an extra ++ for gubblefluff and snigglefingers.
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Thanks for the support everyone. This is the kind of shit I have to deal with every day. Briefs and tech specs are rare. We're always on a really tight deadline so it's common to start work on a project before we know what we're building. It then morphs into something closer to what the client wants with each 'amend'. The PM is also a Director so there's only so far I can push him to correct his bad management. Besides, he claims that it's all the client's fault. FML.
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@sarneeh, I want to ++++ you.
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@sarneeh Wow. Not thought about asking for the full specs before. I'll totes try that. Thanks. ;)
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@DeadInside not as a criticism, but really there should be a way to just refuse to do the job without at least semi-proper requirements? Some email with explanations? Something?
Surely it will be easier for your boss to ask this from the client upfront rather than try to find a new dev. -
@elazar you're right but it doesn't work like that here. Even the written specs are later (verbally) amended. Then we get sent files like 'clientFinalAmends_final-v3.updated.docx' that may or may not supercede the verbal stuff. Any interaction with him is the same:
Me: Can I get you a sandwich?
PM: Sure, can I have a cheese one.
...
Me: Here you go. It was £2.
PM: Ta, I'll pay you later. Oh, this is on white. Did they not have better cheese? Where's my drink? -
@DeadInside I don't know if it was a sarcasm or not 😀 But anyways - man, you're a programmer. If there are people that disrespect you and your time by not giving you full specs even if you ask for it - just kick them in the ass. You will find a new job easily. Peace bro, didn't want to sound offensive ☺
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@sarneeh yes that was sarcasm. It's the only thing I can do well. FYI you didn't offend me at all. Your criticism is a valid one.
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Man you literally are @DeadInside I feel sorry man..you have amazing patience though
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@dfox give him stress ball anyway....
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Man, that is easy to solve, you do not code shit until a brief, docs and the stupid mockups, graphics etc are delivered and approved.
One you teach people that, you will start getting it. Demostrate with data why working like this is more expensive and time wasting.
Blame it on them for miss use of coman resources and stablish the mees of specs. -
@elazar Before leaving my last job I constantly asked for full specification to resolve this same issue I had. I asked all questions I could to grasp all requirements and suppress any late surprise. The fact is there were always unspoken requirements. When you have no idea of what is expected, all questions you can come with are not enough.
An entirely typical exchange at work:
PM: How long would it take to build an application that collates Gubblefluffs and exports them as a PDF?
ME: Hard to say. What’s a Gubblefluff?
PM: Nothing complex. Its basically an object with some stuff in.
ME: Erm, okay. So I’ll define a Gubblefluff object plus methods to add edit and delete, then for each Gubblefluff have it write a line to a PDF.
PM: It will need to email that PDF to somebody.
ME: Okay, cool. “Gubblefluffs-by-email” should take about a day.
6 hours later…
ME: I’ve done Gubblefluffs-to-pdf, I’m not clear on what’s in a Gubblefluff but I’ve made it flexible so it can take almost anything.
PM: No, a Gubblefluff can ONLY be one of 4 Snigglefingers plus a timestamp and some JSON.
ME: What? Right. Okay. What’s a Snigglefinger?
PM: (sighs) A Snigglefinger is the collection of relevant Babelsets.
ME: Babelsets?
PM: Yeah, a user can have any number of Babelsets but they must correspond to one of the four types of Snigglefingers.
ME: There are users!?
PM: Of course!
ME: But I’ve not coded anything for users.
PM: Shit. I’ve told the client they can have it today. How long to add in users?
ME: And Babelsets, and Snigglefingers and the new Gubblefluff rules?
PM: Yeah.
6 days later…
ME: This is done now. It’s a beast but it works. Who should it email the PDFs to?
PM: Client X, plus cc to Y and bcc to Z.
ME: What? It doesn't support CC and BCC!
1 hour later…
ME: This is done. I’ve tested it and sent you a copy of the PDF it generates.
PM: Okay thanks. Is the cron running daily?
ME: What cron?
…
ME: Okay, so the cron’s running once a day at 8pm.
PM: Oh, it’ll need to be at 3:15pm. That’s when we’ve told the client they’ll get it.
ME: Right. I’ll change it...
PM: Also, the PDF you sent me looks nothing like the visual.
ME: What visual?
...
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