I posted a !rant a couple of days ago saying I started to get the hang of vim to change from atom (which is a memory asshole)... So after trying to actually work using vim I noticed I am far more productive using atom, so I gave VS Code a chance... Wow, it's like having atom but only consuming 80mbs tops. I think I decided what will be my default ide.

Still glad I know understand vim, I will still use it but not as my default ide.

Uhm ... those are text editors not IDEs

Yeah VS Code is awesome. I ditched Atom a while back. Here's hoping MS doesn't turn VS Code into a memory hog.

@catintroholic They have everything we need for web dev, including command line support, hence they're for all intents and purposes IDEs.

That said, I think we should see if we can turn this rant into a 200+ comment flamewar about what constitutes an IDE and what doesn't.

@Ratwerks Okay, I'mma start this war now 😋

@Ratwerks maybe you could point VScode more in the direction of an IDE, but just because you can install packages in atom, it isn't an IDE and vim is totally a text editor a complex one for sure but definitely a text editor

ya VS Code is amazing though a year ago it used to eat CPU and RAM on startup, but that got fixed later on.
What I am getting afraid of is MS is including their extensions by default now and that's not something I'd like, especially if they decide to make them non removable extensions?

@catintroholic I have linting, syntax highlighting, compile hotkeys, etc in vim... I don't use it as primary IDE, but I'd say, the term 'development environment' fits a lot better than 'text editor'.

But it's for sure an IDE which requires some configuration.
Same applies to atom. Atom is like Eclipse: Developed very modular, so that it doesn't support any language particularly well out of the box, but can be adapted for any language /framework /etc.
Not calling Atom or eclipse an IDE because your need to set them up first (Exlipse however is available in many preconfigured versions) would not be fair though.

What qualifies as an IDE anyway?

You don't have even nearly all of the functionality in those packages in atom than in Eclipse, There's a huge difference in working with eclipse and with atom

@catintroholic Yes, but it's still really sufficient to call it an IDE. It's not about quantity but about what these extensions enable you to do.

And to be fair, Atom is also a lot younger than eclipse.

However, Atom has every feature of Eclipse I've been using yet (but I don't particular like Eclipse, so I didn't delve too deep).

So an IDE is a text editor that let's you manage, build, and debug your code; all in the same 'environment'. Additionally it has a degree of awareness in how your code is structured and let's you lookup/navigate to identifiers with minimal effort.

I'm pretty sure there are vim setups out there that can do all of this and more. Atom and VS Code are definitely more than text editors.

@nixclusive Very good question. The term 'Integrated Develop Environment' makes me expect the majority of features which are commonly used by all devs for developing software (so nothing special required). For example these are linting, refactoring tools, syntax highlighting, autocompletion...

Of course, support for every language requires its own grammar for autocompletion and syntax highlighting, so an IDE doesn't have to support every language (especially not out of the box).

@nixclusive0 I think, your definition is far more on point than mine.

The Question is then why certain companies call their products 'text editor' and others 'IDE' there must be a reason behind this

@catintroholic Depends on which audience you want to sell it to. There's no point in calling it IDE, if you're users don't develop software.

Still, some 'text editors' would probably qualify as IDE as well, whereas every IDE qualifies as text editor.