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Oh, you might have brought up a new target for SJWs...
C0D4708223yI believe the real question is, how does a whitelist / blacklist offend you?
Next it will be the nice / naughty list from Santa.
It might be difficult to rename all the backend code instances, but seeing that in a UI still is just distasteful.
Even if you don't agree with the point of view, recognizing that is offensive to many end users, and addressing their concerns is just common sense.
@devphobe While I agree with your last point, it doesn't really hold up when applied. Here's why:
Overwhelmingly, offense is taken, not given. If you go out of your way to make things as "woke" or PC as possible, many of these people will go out of their way to find something to be offended about.
Example: "PiHole" sounds lude! And insensitive to full-sized [read: obese] people! I demand you change the name you fat-shaming pervert!
Literally nothing you do will ever be enough. Give an inch, lose a mile.
Why not just ban all these words...
@devphobe but is this actually brought up by black people? Or is it just white people being assholes?
If I look at the people who made the decision about renaming "master" branch because it's offensive. It's all white dudes.
If I look at the python change suggestion because its offensive: it's done by a white dude.
My black friends feel offended by those things changing because they are being attacked as "being fragile" even though they don't mind those terms.
(especially since slaves don't have a lot to do with race, but with strong/weak and rich/poor)
The racism issue is a really good point to tackle but if people go over the top people will say "it's not that bad, if you complain about a master branch, the rest will probably not be that bad either"
We really should be careful when to play the racism/offended card.
Also in our software system we use both white and blacklist and both are people who can't enter (it's a inheritance of another system) is that offensive as well?
@Root yes, we cannot cater to everybody, but why would we not try to cater in this instance. It's easy to see why people would feel offended. The words literally say "white is safer than black". These compound words were common place in our past, it doesn't make them acceptable anymore.
Our grandparents commonly used words now deemed racial slurs. These words are no different, and our entire industry should respond accordingly. Any company that does not will ultimately find themselves being held accountable to their public.
@vintprox so the Bible has to be changed as well?
They talk about bright white light as good and dark as bad.
@Codex404 I'd rather offend somebody who thinks I'm calling them fragile, than offend an entire class of people because I'm in some way being racist.
@vintprox Hiw are those suggestive icons? I read your comment and assumed the icons were a white person and a No circle around a black silhouette. That would be suggestive. Instead they are a check and a No circle. Those are fitting icons, and not racially suggestive at all. 😕
Unless your comment was sarcasm and I just missed it? There have been several very serious comments immediately before yours.
@devphobe Have the class of people explain to you how you're being racist, and change your behavior accordingly. Don't let an unaffected actor/mouthpiece just tell you matter-of-factly without explanation.
@devphobe Assuming you would offend an entire class of people is exactly the sort of thinking you claim to be attacking, just in the opposite direction.
Holy shit, my post got downvoted because satire isn't a thing anymore 😂
@Codex404 the bible also says: https://youtube.com/watch/...
@odite so sorry.
@devphobe so you are rather being a racist by avoiding being a racist then not be a racist. Makes sense mate
@devphobe I'm pretty sure the connotations of white/black meaning positive and negative are rooted in lightness and darkness.
And I mean literal lightness and darkness. Why are we now forgetting that and choosing to assign it to race? I've never even thought about it like that before.
@odite a weed, rooted in the beat soil on earth, is still a weed. Yes, those words may have been intended for many things in the past, but today is different.
C0D4708223y@odite because.... snowflakes.
@devphobe no it isn't. The only way it could be is if everyone looks through everything through the prism of race and if you count yourself among those who do then you should look inward as to why.
But nah, fuck that, lets alter language.
@devphobe Except, if there are entirely legitimate uses of the words without the connotations you condemn, why should we abandon the words entirely? That results in losing meaning unnecessarily for the sake of pacifying ignorant complaints. I much prefer educational explanation to arbitrary compromise on meaning.
@odite indeed, as I said before: trying to hard to avoid to do something that might or might not be racist tend to make people racist.
And to explain it: only someone looking to avoid using something sees that something in things that are not.
Or in other words,
By trying to avoid being racist you will look at everything to see if it can be linked to race differences. Looking for differences is in itself racist.
Yes let's derail from the issue of people literally dying because of the color of their skin to address your word fetish.
Like a true white, let's sweep the real issue under the rug and jerk off to our brand new """improvements""". We made the world better by changing a few fucking words, didn' we?
[Apply sarcasm to your sensitive area]
What the fuck is "lude," autocorrect?
Please use \s
Just came to read the comments *munch popcorn*
@devphobe The whole thing about white being people also doesn't have to mean anything.
Some centuries ago, white was not associated with good because of white people, but because of cleanliness. Because white clothing:
- was expensive
- showed dirt much more quickly and thus seemed to get dirty much faster
- was expensive to keep that clean all the time
That terminology of white equaling cleanliness, richness, goodness is probably much older than the topic of racism. I'm not religious and know nothing about the bible, but I guess it wouldn't be held that high today if the associations regarding white were purely racist.
Other than that: Who really thinks the majority of the time when working with whitelists of white people and the racism??
Heck, it's the first time someone made me think that the master branch is racist other than the master "branch". Not slave owner, a effing abstract branch. I'm not always personifying a word.
Children may do that.
Also: Theoretically no one could assume someone to be racist here. Anyone here could be black and just use a white avatar. No one knows.
Also assuming that black people are incapable to be racist is in turn racist to them again.
Somewhat edgy but is true in my opinion: https://youtu.be/tbud8rLejLM
Nobody likes changes. Meeting people if different cultures is weird and people who look and/or behave otherwise is, too. Just as anybody feels discomfort when someone changes to his/her/its routines (unless someone is really used to it).
Discomfort is often expressed as disliking the source of discomfort. Just my opinion, but it thing that in some (cruel) way being racist is just a form of feeling discomfort.
@C0D4 I think Microsoft already proved that doing anything with santa is already offensive
@devphobe No, it's not different at all.
Just because someone interprets something as having to do with something negative for them, should not mean that I should change my wording, that's literally censorship.
@Codex404 Has a very good point. (the black/white light thing)
If you choose to interpret this differently, that shouldn't be the problem of the person who chooses the word.
I fucking hate that the British NCSC changed blacklist to 'deny' list as those terms do *NOT* mean the same. This wouldn't be much of an issue were it not for the fact that in cyber security (where I'm at) those words have a very different meaning in certain contexts which is going to be very annoying and confusing in communications.
I'll continue with the word master and blacklist since they're both completely correct in the contexts I use them in!
gitlog64073yI am brown and I am fucking ok with it
Let the name be master
Let the terms be blacklist and whitelist
Those are fucking technical terms
Don't change the old ones
Change the new upcoming terms
@gitlog But why change the new ones if those terms are in a technical context?
@linuxxx he means don't name the new ones in a demeaning way. Like, don't name it slave, name it "server" or "provider" or "worker" or something else that fits the context. 😛
@NoMad Okay but slave has nothing to do with slavery in this context so why would you omit that?
@linuxxx because you're already having this argument once 😛
That's it, I want to talk with your Group Management!
SJW are cancer
Wtf? Why is PiHole a racist?