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I'm drunk and I'll probably regret this, but here's a drunken rank of things I've learned as an engineer for the past 10 years.
The best way I've advanced my career is by changing companies.
Technology stacks don't really matter because there are like 15 basic patterns of software engineering in my field that apply. I work in data so it's not going to be the same as webdev or embedded. But all fields have about 10-20 core principles and the tech stack is just trying to make those things easier, so don't fret overit.
There's a reason why people recommend job hunting. If I'm unsatisfied at a job, it's probably time to move on.
I've made some good, lifelong friends at companies I've worked with. I don't need to make that a requirement of every place I work. I've been perfectly happy working at places where I didn't form friendships with my coworkers and I've been unhappy at places where I made some great friends.
I've learned to be honest with my manager. Not too honest, but honest enough where I can be authentic at work. What's the worse that can happen? He fire me? I'll just pick up a new job in 2 weeks.
If I'm awaken at 2am from being on-call for more than once per quarter, then something is seriously wrong and I will either fix it or quit.
pour another glass
Qualities of a good manager share a lot of qualities of a good engineer.
When I first started, I was enamored with technology and programming and computer science. I'm over it.
Good code is code that can be understood by a junior engineer. Great code can be understood by a first year CS freshman. The best code is no code at all.
The most underrated skill to learn as an engineer is how to document. Fuck, someone please teach me how to write good documentation. Seriously, if there's any recommendations, I'd seriously pay for a course (like probably a lot of money, maybe 1k for a course if it guaranteed that I could write good docs.)
Related to above, writing good proposals for changes is a great skill.
Almost every holy war out there (vim vs emacs, mac vs linux, whatever) doesn't matter... except one. See below.
The older I get, the more I appreciate dynamic languages. Fuck, I said it. Fight me.
If I ever find myself thinking I'm the smartest person in the room, it's time to leave.
I don't know why full stack webdevs are paid so poorly. No really, they should be paid like half a mil a year just base salary. Fuck they have to understand both front end AND back end AND how different browsers work AND networking AND databases AND caching AND differences between web and mobile AND omg what the fuck there's another framework out there that companies want to use? Seriously, why are webdevs paid so little.
We should hire more interns, they're awesome. Those energetic little fucks with their ideas. Even better when they can question or criticize something. I love interns.
Don't meet your heroes. I paid 5k to take a course by one of my heroes. He's a brilliant man, but at the end of it I realized that he's making it up as he goes along like the rest of us.
Tech stack matters. OK I just said tech stack doesn't matter, but hear me out. If you hear Python dev vs C++ dev, you think very different things, right? That's because certain tools are really good at certain jobs. If you're not sure what you want to do, just do Java. It's a shitty programming language that's good at almost everything.
The greatest programming language ever is lisp. I should learn lisp.
For beginners, the most lucrative programming language to learn is SQL. Fuck all other languages. If you know SQL and nothing else, you can make bank. Payroll specialtist? Maybe 50k. Payroll specialist who knows SQL? 90k. Average joe with organizational skills at big corp? $40k. Average joe with organization skills AND sql? Call yourself a PM and earn $150k.
Tests are important but TDD is a damn cult.
Cushy government jobs are not what they are cracked up to be, at least for early to mid-career engineers. Sure, $120k + bennies + pension sound great, but you'll be selling your soul to work on esoteric proprietary technology. Much respect to government workers but seriously there's a reason why the median age for engineers at those places is 50+. Advice does not apply to government contractors.
Third party recruiters are leeches. However, if you find a good one, seriously develop a good relationship with them. They can help bootstrap your career. How do you know if you have a good one? If they've been a third party recruiter for more than 3 years, they're probably bad. The good ones typically become recruiters are large companies.
Options are worthless or can make you a millionaire. They're probably worthless unless the headcount of engineering is more than 100. Then maybe they are worth something within this decade.
Work from home is the tits. But lack of whiteboarding sucks.39
Fuck the memes.
Fuck the framework battles.
Fuck the language battles.
Fuck the titles.
Anybody who has been in this field long enough knows that it doesn't matter if your linus fucking torvalds, there is no human who has lived or ever will live that simultaneously understands, knows, and remembers how to implement, in multiple languages, the following:
- jest mocks for complex React components (partial mocks, full mocks, no mocks at all!)
- token cancellation for asynchronous Tasks in C#
- fullstack CRUD, REST, and websocket communication (throw in gRPC for bonus points)
- database query optimization, seeding, and design
- nginx routing, https redirection
- build automation with full test coverage and environment consideration
- docker container versioning, restoration, and cleanup
- internationalization on both the front AND backends
- secret storage, security audits
- package management, maintenence, and deprecation reviews
- integrating with dozens of APIs
- fucking how to center a div
and that's a _comically_ incomplete list; barely scratches the surface of the full range of what a dev can encounter in a given day of writing software
have many of us probably done one or even all of these at different times? surely.
but does that mean we are supposed to draw that up at a moment's notice some cookie-cutter solution like a fucking robot and spit out an answer on a fax sheet?
recruiters, if you read this site (perhaps only the good ones do anyway so its wasted oxygen), just know that whoever you hire its literally the luck of the draw of how well they perform during the interview. sure, perhaps some perform better, but you can never know how good someone is until they literally start working at your org, so... have fun with that.
Oh and I almost forgot, again for you recruiters, on top of that list which you probably won't ever understand for the entirety of your lives, you can also add writing documentation, backup scripts, and orchestrating / administrating fucking JIRA or actually any somewhat technical dashboard like a CMS or website, because once again, the devs are the only truly competent ones - and i don't even mean in a technical sense, i mean in a HUMAN sense of GETTING SHIT DONE IN GENERAL.
There's literally 2 types of people in the world: those who sit around drawing flow charts and talking on the phone all day, and those WHO LITERALLY FUCKING BUILD THE WORLD
why don't i just run the whole fucking company at this point? you guys are "celebrating" that you made literally $5 dollars from a single customer and i'm just sitting here coding 12 hours a day like all is fine and well
i'm so ANGRY its always the same no matter where i go, non-technical people have just no clue, even when you implore them how long things take, they just nod and smile and say "we'll do it the MVP way". sure, fine, you can do that like 2 or 3 times, but not for 6 fucking months until you have a stack of "MVPs" that come toppling down like the garbage they are.
How do expect to keep the "momentum" of your customers and sales (I hope you can hear the hatred of each of these market words as I type them) if the entire system is glued together with ducktape because YOU wanted to expedite the feature by doing it the EASY way instead of the RIGHT way. god, just forget it, nobody is going to listen anyway, its like the 5th time a row in my life
we NEED tests!
we NEED to know our code coverage!
we NEED to design our system to handle large amounts of traffic!
we NEED detailed logging!
we NEED to start building an exception database!
BILBO BAGGINS! I'm not trying to hurt you! I'm trying to help you!
Don't really know what this rant was, I'm just raging and all over the place at the universe. I'm going to bed.20
Root: Fleshes out missing data in some factories. Tests affected code and finds the change breaks some specs (but shouldn’t).
Root: Reaches out to spec author.
Root: Messages thundercunt (the ticket’s code reviewer) on slack about the specs and the reaching out. No response.
Root: Works on another ticket while blocked.
Root: Logs off.
Root: Talks with spec author chick in the morning. Decide to pair on specs later.
TC: Still no slack response.
Root: Gives update in standup. Mentions factories and broken specs. Mentions pairing with spec chick.
TC: Still no slack response.
Root: Pulled off tickets in favor of prod issue. Gets ignored by everyone else diagnosing prod issue. Investigates prod issue by herself. Discovers prod issue isn’t from bad code, but bad requirements — code works as requested. Communicates this with details. Gets ignored by people still diagnosing prod issue. Tries again. Gets ignored. Gives up. Works on non-blocked tickets instead.
TC: Still no slack response.
TC: Comments on PR telling me I broke specs (how did I not notice?), that I need to reach out to spec chick and work with her, and that I can’t resolve the ticket until it’s fixed and passes code review.
TC: Still no slack response. (21 hours later at this point)
TC: Logs off. Still no response (25 hours at this point)
Ignoring the prod issue for the moment…
I broke specs. No shit.
I need to talk with spec chick. No shit.
I can’t resolve the ticket. No shit!
Bitch, I told you all of this 21 fucking hours prior, and again 3 hours prior during standup. But no, I clearly “don’t communicate” and obviously have no bloody clue what I’m doing, either, so I need everything spelled out for me.
And no, I didn’t resolve the fucking ticket. Why the fuck would I if it still has pending changes? Do you even check? Ugh!
And what the fuck with that prod issue? I’m literally giving you the answer. fucking listen! Stupid cunts.
Why is it all of the women I work with are useless or freaking awful people? Don’t get me wrong, many of the men are, too, but I swear it’s every single one of the women. (Am I awful, too?)
I can’t wait to leave this sewer of a company.
Oddly still a good day, though. Probably because I talked to recruiters and sent out my resume again.16
Try training your AI model without using captured data of real recruiters and their dodgy practices.2
Headhunter: So how many years of experience do you have with X?
Me: Why does it matter? I have been a software engineer for a decade, I can pick up anything in a matter of weeks.
Headhunter: *writes in his notepad: 0 experience with X"*6
Post after a long long time...
Wanted to reply to so many comments and mentions, rant about a bunch of topics, do a face reveal after I went for a vacation with family and got some pictures, update y'all on my job hunt, but was busy like hell.
Anyway, time for a story.
After my rejection with Meta and Booking, I started preparing like crazy and my interviews started going well. Refined my LinkedIn further and recruiters started reaching out as well.
Over time, with efforts and feedback, I was able to build a good pipeline.
One of my dream companies reached out to me and I got hired in just 1 round and all others were merely a formality. I was euphoric, but at the same time didn't get over excited as this seemed fishy.
They made a very good monetary offer and I didn't talk to my manager yet regarding resignation. They are pushing me for an early joining.
Read a bunch of Glassdoor reviews and also spoke to a friend who just recently quit that organisation.
He confirmed that the company has 3 months of notice, has sandwich leave policy, and some other XLT political mess.
I decided to decline the offer tomorrow.
Day saved? Not yet.
Because of this I slacked off work a lot. I am super screwed with work items pending because I thought I'd quit.
My boss resinged and new one isn't that supportive yet. He is trying to change everything overnight. Typical.
I ended up performing poorly in other companies because I was confident I'll pick this offer and didn't prepare for upcoming good companies.
Moreover, we have our offices opening up from April and I might be asked to relocate to another city which does not have a team but just because it is on paper, they might force me to be in office 50% of the time.
And what's worse is, my relationship with tech is deteriorating and they are putting the entire product team in bad light.
I have a planned weekend trip coming up, so I won't be able to prepare for interviews or work on case studies so that shit will pile up more.
I am sooooo fucking screwed. Life was stable and then all of a sudden too 180° flip.
I am hysterical right now.17
New spin on the Manager / Dev format!
Recuiter: WE NEED AN ABSOLUTE NODE EXPERT, NODE NODE NODE, WE LOVE NODE! WHAT IS YOUR NODE EXPERIENCE?!?!
Dev: Well I've had exposure to it since it was nearly new, all the way back in 2012, and since my professional career started about 7 years ago I've used it fairly often on a per-project basis.
Recruiter: WELL HAVE YOU BEEN USING IT DAILY FOR THE PAST 5 YEARS!?!
Dev: Well no, as I said I've used it for specific projects... anyway, there are these things called weekends...
Recruiter: WELL WE ONLY WANT NODE ZOMBIES SO SORRY.
Dev: Thanks for reaching out and wasting my time.
God recruiters are like robots, don't they understand senior-level engineers are language agnostic?6
So I was interviewing at company X, through recruiter A. It all went well - one of the best feedbacks I have ever received actually, but then they went quiet for a bit... only to have the recruiter A call me about 3 days later and tell me that apparently the project they had planned to get me on, was a no go for a while and that they would contact me again within a month or so.
Meanwhile, recruiter B called me up and sent me to company Y and asked me what my situation was at other interviews. I said that I was interviewing at company X and that they came back to me and said the project is delayed and they'll contact me within a month or so.
Recruiter B starts a rant about how he hates when companies do that and that he, as a recruiter, would loose trust in that company if something like that happened.
And now company Y goes quiet for 2 days. Recruiter B calls me and says exactly the same thing.
So naturally, I say - "ah that's a shame, you must be loosing trust in company Y now."
He pauses and says - "Well umm"... another big pause. "I see what you mean, but umm..." another pause and this awkward silence.
"thanks", I said and I hung up. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯7
now a funny thing that happened to me a few weeks ago:
a recruiter contacted me on linkedin... wait, don't laugh yet, that's not the whole joke (this time)...
...asking whether I'm interested in something, I was like yeah, but I'm looking for part-time because i'd like to not have a mental breakdown after 6 months this time...
her response: "well... I don't have any part-times, but I have an almost part-time..."
" 'almost part-time'? first time I've heard that phrase, what exactly does that mean?"
"it means about 160 hours"
... i sit in confused silence for a bit, then write back as I calculate: "i'm assuming you mean 160 hours a month, which is 40 hours a week, which is 8 hours a day, which is full-time. please point out where am I mistaken."
recruiter: * crickets *8
- Get invited to apply to job
- Technical interview, guy shows up late starts small talk wasting time and gives me the exercise
- Start implementing the first algorithm, finish it passing min test cases then realize there's a solution that would make both algorithms a breeze
- I pitch my solution realizing there's no much time left, cuz we lost almost 20 min of my test hour talking about BS plus the almost 10 min he arrived late, and reassure the interviewer it can be developed faster
- Interviewer says it doesn't matter, we should finish edge cases
- Kay no problem, finish the first algorithm successfully and explain pitfalls on the second part with the current implementation
- I tell him there's a better solution but he doesn't seem to care, he says time's up
Now here's the funny part.
I get called by the recruiter today (2 weeks later) and she says "They are happy with your soft skills but feel there are some gaps with your coding, they would like to repeat the technical interview because they didn't feel there was much time to assess the 'gaps' ".
Interviewers, either I'm competent enough to work for you or not, your tests must be designed to assess that, if you see you can't fit the problem you want in the time you have left change the problem, reschedule or here's an idea...LEAVE THE BS CHITCHAT TILL THE END AND START THE INTERVIEW ON TIME. When I do interviews I always try to have one complete free hour and a one algorithm exercise because I expect the candidate to solve it, analyze it and offer alternatives or explain it, I've never had someone finishing more than 2 an hour.
You can keep your job I'll keep my time. I'll write a similar problem on the comments to pass on the knowledge for people who enjoy solving these kinds of problems, can't give you the exact same thing, also tip guys don't do NDA's for interviewing it makes no fucking sense trust me no one cares about your fizz buzz intellectual property.13
Ha ha ha ha. Fucking morons!
You brag about being a highly skilled company.
You tell me I don’t have enough experience despite three years of uninterrupted activity where I currently work
You’re willing to give me a chance (I just don’t know how to express my gratitude)
BUT among your super talented team members you can’t find anybody capable of conducting a technical interview?? And you’ve been looking for over a month for someone who could do it?
Thanks for wasting my time with three useless HR interviews you worthless DIPSHITS!2
had an interview...fuker didnt show up -.-
how you supposed to find a new job when even the recruiters dont gaf4
This brings joy
A series of scandals and missteps has damaged Facebook's reputation so much that the company is being forced to pay ever larger compensation to hire and retain workers, according to industry recruiters, former employees, and data reviewed by Insider.
The company has always competed aggressively for talent, and the tech job market in general is on fire. But a deteriorating public image means the social-media giant now has to outbid other major tech companies, such as Google.
"One thing Facebook can still do is pay a lot more," said Jose Guardado, an experienced tech recruiter and the founder of Build Talent. "They can easily throw more compensation at people they currently have, and cover any brand tax and pay a little more to get people to come on."
Silicon Valley companies thrive or whither based on their ability to recruit the smartest employees. Without a steady influx of engineers and other technical experts, new products and important updates take longer to release, and rivals can quickly get ahead. Then there's the financial cost: In 2022, Facebook projected, expenses could jump as high as $97 billion from $70 billion this year, in large part because of "investments in technical and product talent." A company spokesperson did not respond to a request for comment.
Other companies, and even whole industries, have had to increase compensation to overcome hiring and retention problems caused by scandal and shifting public perceptions, said Alan Johnson, a managing director at the compensation consulting firm Johnson Associates. "If you're an oil company, if you make cigarettes, if you're in cattle or Wells Fargo, sure," he said.
How well this is working for Facebook is debatable as the company has more than 4,300 open jobs and has seen decreasing rates of acceptance on job offers, according to internal documents reported by Protocol. It's also seen dozens of high-level executives leave this year, and recruiters say employees are now more open to considering jobs elsewhere. Facebook used to be a place that people rarely left, given its reach, pay, and perks.
A former Oculus engineer who left last year said Facebook could now be seen as a "black mark" on someone's career. A hardware engineer who exited in 2020 shared similar sentiments: They said they quit because of concerns about misinformation on the platform and the effect of that on children. Another employee said their department was dissolved in late 2019 by Facebook and, although the company offered another position that paid more, they left last year anyway for a different industry. The workers, and many other people who spoke with Insider for this story, asked not to be identified because of the sensitive nature of the topic.
For those who stick around and people who take new jobs at Facebook, base pay and stock grants have gone up a "sizable" amount in the past year, said Zuhayeer Musa, cofounder of Levels.fyi, a platform that collects pay data based on verified offers and compensation disclosures.
During the second quarter of 2021, the median compensation for an upper-mid-level engineer, an E5, was $400,000, up from $380,000 a year earlier. For an E4, the median pay jumped to $276,000 from $256,000 in the same period. For both groups, the increases were double the gains between 2018 and 2019, Levels.fyi data showed.
Musa, who's firm also offers pay-negotiation coaching, said previously that the total compensation ceiling for an E5 engineer at Facebook was $450,000. "We recently had a client get up to $510,000 for E5," he added.
Equity awards at the company are getting more generous, too. At the group-director and VP levels, Facebook staff are getting $3 million to $6 million in restricted stock units each year, another tech recruiter said. Directors and managers are getting on average $1 million a year. In engineering, a high-level engineer is getting $600,000 in stock and a $75,000 bonus, while even an entry-level engineer is getting $50,000 to $100,000 in stock and a $20,000 to $50,000 bonus, Levels.fyi data indicated.
Even compared to Google, Facebook's stock awards are generous and increasing, Levels.fyi data shows. While base pay is about the same, Facebook offers more in stock grants, significantly increasing total compensation. At Google, entry-level equity awards range from $20,000 to $38,000, while Facebook grants are worth $40,000 to $60,000. Sign-on bonuses at Facebook are often about $50,000, while Google gives about $20,000, according to the data.
"It's not normal, but it's consistent with the craziness that's happening in the market right now," said Aalap Shah, a managing director focused on the tech industry at the consulting firm Pearl Meyer.10
Story time on my job hunt: Currently interviewing with Google during my notice period.
I always had a love hate relationship with Google. Unlike my hate towards Meta or Amazon, where I had a reason to hate them for how ill intended they are, I never had a valid reason to dislike or hate Google apart from the fact that they steal my data.
That's it. That's my only reason why I hate Google. But I fell in love with their products during my trip to Istanbul and how throughout my journey, Google products were there for me to solve all my needs.
As y'all know, I was treated badly during my Meta interview, last October. With Google, the experience is on another level.
People are fucking smart and ingenious, but at the same time very polite, humble, and respectful.
During my 3 interviews so far (2 more remaining), each one of them made me so comfortable that I was more anxious before the interview than during or after.
They supported me during each question they asked. They made me felt heard and focused on my strength, instead of the weaknesses (or trying to break me down unnecessarily).
The interview syllabus is so fucking vast, and recruiters know so much that they helped me not only with preparation material, but also guided me personally. Haven't seen such knowledgeable recruiters.
The questions were dynamic in nature and thankfully because of my preparation, I was able to answer them most.
Overall, the culture at Google seems brilliant and an environment where one can flourish. No wonder companies are trying to copy every aspect of how Google operates and no surprise that Google is doing well at scale.
I feel so high on emotions (positively), after these interviews that I wonder how would it be to work at Google with such phenomenal people and exceptional environment.7
People on dating apps say they are very pissed off and frustrated when they’re ghosted.
As a developer you get eager calls from recruiters talking for hours. They say I’ll catch up with you first thing in the morning. An HR manager says I’ll get back to you in 14 hours (in 14 hours?? very precise). Even you get a contract offer from a manager who is rapidly contacts and convinces you.
Than you hear nothing, you are left on read.
“Professionals” communicate in that way. They are also getting paid whilst taking your time. What can you say to random people behind nicknames?
I don’t know what I would feel if they get back and I’m zombied. I really feel like unmatching meh.7
Me: So you have no work experience, and majored in liberal arts, but you did go through a 6 months bootcamp, right?
Me: sounds good, we will have to work together with you for a long while until you become independent, but I think you can definitely do this. What are you salary expectations?
Candidate: I'm thinking of 5000.
Me: Aight, thanks for your time! We'll send you more details later
Around here, 5000 (arbitrary made up number) is what you pay someone with around 3 years of experience at least. It's always these pampered fucks from rich countries that want to earn a shitton of money for the grand effort of going to a goddamn bootcamp for some months. That is their definition of effort and hard work, because it seems they've never once in their lives had any sort of hardship or struggle beyond crying that dad got them an Android instead of an iPhone. If you leave them alone they can't do jack shit because they've never worked in real, big projects, so you gotta invest a lot of time in them. Which is fine, everyone starts from somewhere. But what kinda balls do you have to demand a mid level salary when you have done basically nothing so far, and your knowledge is superficial at best?
I know that a lot of jobs and recruiters give bottom of the barrel shit, but I swear some candidates are insane. Unpopular rant I assume but I just needed to scream a bit.10
Some recruiter just reached out on LinkedIn to talk about a job opportunity with me.
I suggested he give me an idea of the pay range before i proceed and talk to anyone in the company so we dont waste eachothers time.
He said they can realistically pay X/month.
I explained that X is less than half my current salary (Y) so i wont proceed with this.
He replied by saying "oh nice, thats a great salary for your experience"
WTF is that supposed mean? did the bitch say im underqualified to get paid my current salary?10
It's official, I've come full circle:
"I assume you're not looking for a new opportunity right now, but do you know anybody that might be interested, or do you have someone to refer?"
Yes, let me do more work for you, even though you aren't interested in me at the moment. Shameless linking to a previous post which is the same: https://devrant.com/rants/5404347/...
At this point, I'm convinced its going to repeat until about 2050 when the entire software industry comes to a complete and catastrophic standstill.3
Well, this one I HAVEN'T seen before. I'm officially getting emails from recruiters addressed to someone else's name
Today, apparently my name is Mateus.9
1. Apply to as mant jobs as possible daily on dice/linkedin/indeed
using keyword resumes customized by scrapping
2. Filter out low-effort crap companies and filter out recruiters.
3. Post "dice/indeed/linkedin daily decrapified."
Tada! Fewer time-wasters during the job hunt.
4. Bonus: turn into a search engine.
5. Daily double round: turn crap listings and quality listings into AI training sets. Incorporate into search engine.
If industry can use bullshit hiring filters, we can use application filters!5
Job posting: "we require 1.5 years of experience in iOS development"
Also job posting: *doesn't mention a requirement for a degree*
Me: "Cool, this looks exactly like a job for me, I'll send them my résumé!
Recruiter returns to me a day after with this:
"You said you have no work experience, we said in the posting that you need to have 1.5 years of work experience"
THE JOB POSTING DOES NOT MENTION THIS ANYWHERE, THEY ONLY MENTION EXPERIENCE IN IOS DEVELOPMENT
WHY MAKE IT SO AMBIGUOUS AND THEN CHANGE YOUR STANCE
When I finally get a fucking response from a recruiter after sending my résumé to dozens upon dozens of companies, it's a bullshit response.
Note: I am aware of the massive amount of AltRant crashes, I am sorry for making it worse. I need to work on 2 more major final tests that I must pass, but I think I will start fixing some of the crashes today.56
I recently got into an interview where the interviewer made a huge mistake:
R: “what’s your resignation period?”
Me: “well, long story short I’m working on a contract so it’s actually short, just 1 month”
R: “mhhh could you make it 2 weeks somehow? We may really need to start sooner”
This is a sentence you shouldn’t say as a recruiter as now I know:
- You are desperate to find someone
- You have a time urgency
- You failed to find someone before
- You basically confirmed you want me in9
"Ability to work under pressure and work with cross functional teams to meet tight deadlines."
Fuck the managers of whatever shithole you want to drag me to. Nope.1
Had a recruiter say I was saying "wasting his time" by constantly declining job opportunities he sent via email (it was a mass email too). Another recruiter started questioning why I didn't work for this other company that didn't seem to have technology as a decent focus at its core. I'm honestly done with recruiters.3
If you want recruiters to stop messaging you on linkedin. Change your job title to "Professional Cleaner".
Follow me for more tips on how to get rid of the blood sucking leaches7
Why is it that when a job ad a recruiter sends has a salary range and they then ask your current salary and expected salary, they're shocked when you want a substantial increase in salary when it's still within the range they posted for the role. Sure it's more than 20% of my current job but if the new job can pay more than that and they say they can why should I lowball? Why does my current salary matter for the new jobs salary?22
Linkedin/Jura/Monster/[other job finding websites] should add a feature:
A button that reads "lying mofo or dumbass" on each job ad.
For those employers and recruiters who don't understand that neither a senior role nor any role that requires a PhD is classified as an "entry level".
Unfortunately there are so many such dumbfucks I can't blacklist all of them from my job search. 🤬18
So the other day I randomly checked out a few job postings on some recruiting agency’s website. Didn’t even sign up or anything.
The very next day I get a call from them. The person on the phone tells me they noticed I had visited their website and was wondering if I was interested in applying to any of the offers. Even as a developer I was totally taken aback as to how they managed to track me down based on a single visit.
I believe I ended up on their website by clicking on a link on LinkedIn. I’m assuming it’s via LinkedIn that the managed to get my info (phone etc.). All in all I’m not extremely surprised. But to me it’s downright creepy and it makes me feel like I’m being stalked. Also it makes recruiters look totally desperate and I’m not sure I would want to entrust them with the responsibility of handling my career4
In my 6 years of professional experience, after receiving hundreds of messages from recruiters, only 3 of them actually read my profile, where I have very detailed instructions on what I need to consider an offer.
Amazing. Best part is when I tell recruiters they haven't read my profile, they get super defensive.
Is it a job requirement to not be able to read?3
So, I'm a veteran. I served in the Army as an information system operator/analyst. Glorified help desk, set up some equipment in the field, a few other small things. But I can make fun of vets, other branches, and those serving. I've paid my dues, and they're OK with it. Hell, they all do it too. But you have to be a vet or currently serving.
I feel like that with tech too. My buddies and I call each other geeks/nerds all the time. I get annoyed (read as pissed off) when someone from the outside does it.
I got an email from a recruiter that said something along the lines of "..basically a bunch of really smart nerds building software..." What the actual fuck? Go eat an entire bag of dicks, and choke on every single one.12
Recruiters who cold e-mail me get hard and specific questions before I ever give them a resume and phone number. Been doing this too long to just randomly hand a resume and contact info to whoever. YOU came to ME. Make it worth my while.3
Sometimes, I feel like these recruiters are just typing keywords, and spam people who fit.
I did one NodeJS project and I keep getting invited for an interview even though I have less than 3 months' worth of knowledge while the job description states 5 or more years of experience.3
Recruiters on LinkedIn be like "Yu sim like a fit is much good at in company ours indutri tek AI is startup! Google is invest we money in! Kan we talk is good?"
Seriously, lay down the Google translate. Why even bother recruiting in a language themselves can't understand?2
If you put “up to” in front of “proposed salary”, which ofc is a very high number, I put your job offer in the trash. Just put the range or fuck off.
I will never understand how the little brain of recruiters works.
They write shit like we weren’t smart enough to see it.6
My LinkedIn status is set to "not interested for work offers" so recruiters won't bother me. So I thought..
Recruiters be like: well screw that, I'll use the connect button and push my stupid generic message into his face anyways.7
I got a little jaded at work (the normal officer politics stuff), so I started doing less work, and reaching out to recruiters.
My boss noticed I was having a go, reached out and offered a raise and a new computer. I told him I'd have to research market value for the raise.
In the mean time I got an offer for 50% more than what I'm making now. I'm heading to him today with my research in writing. Either way I'm getting that raise!7
After working with a bunch of people it occurred to me that almost anyone can work and learn for most IT positions. This is something that most people will realize, especially if they work with newbies that learn on the go. There are exceptions of course, but most companies are just making crud apps with their business logic.
What I wonder then is, why is it that the way hiring is done seems to be completely against this idea? Rather than whining about recruiters and bad interviews, I am curious about why this is so common. What is it that a lot of companies think or see that make their hiring process so bad or convoluted?11
My LinkedIn is usually pretty quiet. Recently I've received quite a few messages from recruiters. Some of them put numbers in and I look at them, well, the market looks hot.
I like where I am but doesn't hurt to have a look around eh? So I went through some interviews and shit. No preps, not trying to please anyone, being completely honest. And out of the 3 I tried, 1 got to the final round.
Before the final round, the recruiter kept harassing me (it's their job really) about what my "bottom line" is. She said they really liked me but I'm not up to their expectation as a senior role. So they want to proceed with a non-senior role, then climb my ladder up. I told her, I don't give a shit about the title. The she said for that, the salary will be "adjusted" (reads reduced). I told her, look, I said I wouldn't bother if the offer is anything less than X amount of money. Then she said but this company would offer 10% bonus, which will add up , mind you, "close to" X. She said she wanted to know so we don't waste the director's time (as the final round is to meet the bloody director).
I said, if I need to disclose my bottom line before going to this, which is pretty much my negotiation, then let's call it off. No point wasting my time either.
The next day I received the last call from her. They fucked right off.
I know everyone here already knows. But let me experience be another example of how a plague recruiters is. I don't have any experience like this before but this is probably a fucking lowball case too.4
Got a message from recruiter with a proposal on LinkedIn
Answered and say I would be happy to chat.
She sends me a message to tell her about my experience being a dev for pre screening. On LinkedIn....4
devops - im sick of everyone mis-using this term
it seems like everyone in the industry (even famous ppl and youtubers, not just recruiters) have clung to this word and use it as a blanket statement and it pisses me off. two parts of the word, dev (you know, development) and ops (operations, keeping shit going). yet ppl use this whenever there's more than one machine being used or something. like it's in aws must be devops, it's a cluster of machines must be devops, it's a lot of ci/cd so it's clearly devops.
if youre not keeping a system alive, debugging it, fixing errors in the environment -and- creating said environment then using the operations work to influence your development, how is it devops?
you made a build server with some kind of orchestration tool. how is that deovps?
you have a ci/cd pipeline that's in aws. how is that devops?
you built a cloud cluster in aws/gcp/azure but hand it off to another team that monitors it and pokes and prods. how is that devops?9
some recruiter called (and woke my wife and me up) at 9 AM to tell me about a job opportunity that pays less than my current job and offers less remote work1
If you're a recruiter approaching people on linkedin then don't be a fucking idiot and waste their time, get to the fucking point damn it!
No one's interested in going back and forth with you over email especially when you have their number and could be done with it over a phonecall.3
I'm a senior full stack developer with 6 years of experience is it normal to keep receiving internship opportunities from recruiters?9
Recruiter bot just emailed me with some offers, let's take a look...
"Hand-on Experience with SQL and NO-SQL Databases preferably Redux"
Whew! I was worried for a second, thank god they are using a Redux database and not one of those really crappy React databases! I'll really consider applying now.
Does anyone think tech recruiters are failed used car salesmen?
Bad experiences this week
This person who says that she is a recruiter for GOOGLE does not know the difference from UX designer and UX developer.
“ UX design still involves coding... idk where you got information that UX designers don't code but they absolutely do. UX designers are simply front end software engineers that work on refining the user experience of a particular program app or website.”
I don’t know because I used to be a fucking UX developer and used to work with UX designers??? Who didn’t code because figuring out what humans what is tough enough on it’s own. UI designers may know html/css but that is it.
I know we are going into a recession and I need to start being nice to these dumb recruiters because I may need them one day.3
How do you guys get LinkedIn recruiters to annoy you? I want to be annoyed too - I reckon it would help me find places that are hiring7
It really annoys me that many tech recruiters do not have a basic knowledge of the roles they are trying to recruit for and what skill set to look for when they cold message/call potential candidates on LinkedIn.
I make it very clear on my profile that I am a Full Stack Engineer. Still, every other day I get messages about Data Engineering, Frontend Dev or SRE roles. Sometimes a recruiter would insist that I schedule a call with them before they tell me the details, and then I would realize after the call what an absolute waste of time it was.
I have a lot of respect for recruiters. It's not an easy job. But I'm starting to strongly believe that tech recruiters should be made to go through a specialized training to make life easy for themselves and to stop wasting time of people who are not even remotely suitable for their requirements.1
I've actually already discussed this one on here I believe
I see this job looking for an android developer for Kotlin with UI experience with XD & Figma and experience with Firebase. I have all of these qualifications so I throw my resume into the fray within an 2 hours the recruiters contact me. they have an offer of 76,000 and I'm looking for junior so I'm like, eh whatever, I give them a copy of my resume and we hold discussion for a few days and then radio silence. I then see a job posting EXTREMELY similar but with a "different company" so I throw my resume in and again within 2 hours I get a call only THIS TIME ITS THE INTERNAL HR. She sounds interested we have a good conversation and sets me up for 96,000 and they schedule me for my first interview within the week. Interview goes great, next I meet with the CTO and we have a pretty good conversation, I'm expecting a technical exam but it doesn't happen instead they give me a case study. they send me requirements for an app API to use, architecture, and a week time span to do it. I finish the app with extra features within 6 days, in my understanding of MVVM and I was excited and happy about this app because its JUST NICE. a week goes by and I meet with the tech team. They grill me on my application, scalability, use cases, how would I advertise or place advertisement and I'm answering everything they love the UI (I included mockups I made on XD), they say everything sounds good everyone leaves with smiles they say they have to find out on what team to place me because they have multiple apps and that HR will be in contact with me in the next few days... A WEEK GOES BY and I randomly get the declination email that next Friday. When I asked for feedback they said it wasn't true MVVM. I was devastated until the next week when I was accepted for a higher paying job that didn't require me to move. After I accepted this job guess who calls? THE FIRST RECRUITER and for this long I was wondering if this was the same job due to the very similar job description so I ask "is your client XXXXXXX?" it was I just told him "I'm good" and hung up4
My whitewashed LinkedIn profile keeps getting harassed by recruiters when no one looks at my real LinkedIn profile under my Chinese name.
To save everyone's time typing fuck you because I am using LinkedIn. I will type it for you: fuck me.2
Does anyone interact with posts by linkedin "influencers" or recruiters that isn't an "influencer" or recruiter themselve?
Do people exist that actually use linkedin as a social media site?5
Signed up for Prime this morning... And just got 2 emails from Amazon recruiters.
Thought all the tech companies had hiring freezes... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Either way I'm not on the market.4
Recruiter: I just had a look through your skillset and experience and wow - I am impressed. Looks like you have worked with quite a few different languages and those 2 FAANG companies really stand out when looking through your CV. So let me tell you something.. rather than me going through the roles I had in mind for you, why don't you tell me what would be the next big thing for you?
Me: Well I've been looking into Blockchain for a few years now; specifically Solidity and Rust with web3 now. It'd be great to at least have some exposure to any of these.
Recruiter: Ah yes, these are definitely the next big things, however the roles I have here right now for Solidity, Rust or web3, require around 3 years of commercial experience. I have a lead Rust engineer role, however they need someone who has worked on NFT based projects extensively.
Me: Sounds like you have made a decision to send me to another Nodejs/React role, so what's with the big talk then?5
all these fukin job postings...
remote - ya k, great
then the benefits go on to list shit like snacks, cafe or lunch room, on-site gym...
wha?...who? how?...are you ... =|3
I keep on checking if there are recruiters messaging me in LinkedIn,
but I am not actively looking.
and even if something is looking good to me, I feel so rusty on my CS I won't even give it a go...
I just nuked my LinkedIn profile... Now it's an empty dessert.
That should keep the recruiters away!
Shoulda thought of that before I changed my email to a thruway one though...11
Adding recruiters to your job connections is like adding bloat to your application; it's useless and wastes resources.
man i see another group i'm a part of talking about "is it worth it to get degrees" and just, ugh. since this is a place to rant. here is why degrees are fuking useless.
first off, simple, like my friend said before, "if we all have degrees, none of us have degrees"
and let me tell you about some of the people i've had to work with who have degrees...
many dont know what "cd ; ls" is, okay. 4 fukin years, what did these people do?
some people have masters, multiple even, and can't read a for loop that jumps/skips(continue) around certain conditions in their 'favorite' language
looked through my favorite rants on here and there was someone who had a college hire who wrote a "for loop in HTML" L_O_L
degree != skill, ever, period, nada
the best people i have worked with? all degree-less
how is that? why would that have a correlation? degree!=skill but !degree==skill ? initiative? passion? giving a fuk? not droning on in classes that have piss all to do with your desired trade.
sure recruiters and companies will supposedly look at the degree like some special badge or say it's important. but if they've been around, they're savvy that a degree only means you're willing to go in debt and be obedient
i know there are those who don't learn well on their own, or prefer face time or structure, that's fine. but the lie that degrees are required and mean more than they do has only put half of my friends in debt. there's no magical "this person now gives a shit" or knowledge transfer that happens. you have to do that on your own.4
If you are posting a job and you decide to force candidates to create an account on some third party website just to submit a resume, I hope you only get the least qualified people.2
I've been asking recruiters I'd only consider roles for £95k+. I have 3 YoE. Am I being greedy? (In London).15
Why would she contact me for a job that needs ASAP attention and not show up after I gave her my salary expectation, I bet she is expecting a $1-$2 salary expectation from me, crazy recruiters I wonder if there's a university for that shit,
Hi guys, another recruiter shit!!!!1
I am definitely not sean connory.
I wish linkedin recruiters and devs online would stop accusing me of being sean connory.
Why would I..I mean sean connory, who by the way I am definitely NOT...why would I be on devrant anyway?
For the last time, I am not sean connory.6
Every single morning I despair. I can’t stand this job.
Why pay very highly and get very skilled people to have them working 4 to a support ticket. Doing the most mundane support tickets you have ever seen in your life (mainly updating client contact details)?
And why have such a rigorous recruitment process to get people’s in in the first place?
The company is pissing money away by working like this and all the new starters like me think it’s complete shit.
But the bosses and anyone who’s been here a while think it’s great. Company still is making loads of money so they don’t even care about it.
I’ve never met senior developers who have never worked on a greenfield project in their entire careers until I came here.
I can’t believe how I got suckered into this (was head hunted).
Does anyone have a feel for the UK contracting market right now?
I’m considering the jump but I think I’d have to be looking for remote only contracts because where I live has few opportunities ‘on-site’. Preferably c# / angular.
Is there much competition for roles or is there a shortage of skills in the contractors?
The thought of going into another permanent role that could be as bad as this genuinely keeps me awake at night.
I’m not sure I can go somewhere and then have it in the hands of managers to decide what projects I’m going to do and what tech it will be on.
At any big company there’s going to be tech debt as well as new work. So becoming perm now feels like it’s 50-50 whether or not a new job will just mean being put into legacy stuff for a couple of years or doing something that is actually good.
I’ve been talking various people about roles in government departments (multiple different departments are hiring) and because priorities change none the gov recruiters can guarantee what the work is that they’re recruiting for actually is.
Just that the the big recruitment push is to bring work previously done by consultancies back in house. Presumably because consultancies have been fleecing them.5
Looking through a staffing website’s photos of recruiters. They all literally look the same from a distance. Like NPCs generated by the game’s AI. “Which character would you like to pick to ruin the next stage of your professional development?”
Can someone smarter than me make a game that actually hilariously simulates job searches? I’d play that for the mere catharsis and entertainment value.1
Recruiters often tell you to use numbers to highlight your successes. For example, "I did Programming Task ABC and increased sales of widgets by 1,000%". I'm curious how many of us actually have had access to and/or kept track of those kinds of success metrics in our prior jobs. I find myself guessing and even just making up numbers that nobody's going to have even the slightest possibility of verifying.6
Two weeks after being told I’ve got the job I still don’t actually have the actual offer or info on what team I would be joining / role I will be doing.
Meanwhile recruiters are hounding me and other places are interested. Ffs7
Oi mates, TY for telling me how to get LinkedIn recruiters to annoy me - y’all are real for that one !1
This jobhunting with recruiters is such bullshit. Haha. I'm gonna troll my way away from them fuckwits.1
I feel bad for bootcampers. Their schools tell them to apply for a job even if they don’t have all the qualifications because they will learn on the job. That’s fine if you’re applying for an upgrade in the same career path. But when you’re changing careers, a lot of jobs don’t necessarily have time to invest in you like that.
I do have respect for those who DM me on Slack and ask if the job is open to new bootcamp grads. At least they are taking the initiative to ask and not sulking that they’re not good enough.
I tell them “this role requires experience in x. If you have that, then apply” because I don’t actually know they’re not qualified.
I was like them before. It’s hard to get the first job and sometimes it’s a lot of luck. But the first job will make getting the next one easier.
At least they’re not recruiters trying to convince me to pay them to fill the role.1
anti-spam for work recruiters?
anyone have a better method than collecting names and adding to an ever growing list?2
Recruiters are seriously the biggest pests in existence. They are such a useless middle man. They take a big lump sum of cash just to facilitate an employment opportunity for someone that is more than capable to facilitate it themselves. Plus they are huge pests and harass you. Am I crazy? Why do recruiters exist. Surely their entire industry is bad for the economy.2
Why recruiters are sometimes taking so long to answer? I did my final stage of interview with the companie's client (out of 4 stages in total) last Thursday.
Client came back with positive feedback at Monday at the end of workday. Today is Tuesday and internal recruiter was supposed to call me to make an offer and discuss starting date.
Now again workday is nearly over and no contact from her. Tomorrow is a national holiday so she will get back to me at best on Thursday.
Goddamnit why it takes so long, if Im starting next Monday I need to prepare myself. Im seriously getting second thoughts such as even about declining the offer if they will try to lowball me. Previous week they really rushed the process and I had to do 4 stages of interviews and this week they are wasting my time. Am I being impatient or what?2
So I’m tryina put together a resume and I see a lot of dev résumé talking about increased revenue from x to y or user base from z to w.
What I don’t understand is while yes the user base did increase from z to w it wasn’t just you that caused it. The entire company was working hard at it to get there so why are u claiming that it was you. And apparently recruiters love these kpis that u make out of your ass.
Should I give in and just put them in there anyway?
I worked in a startup so my job didn’t really have a definition of what to be told to do and do I had to deal with building front end with vue to figuring out how to automate our deployment flow and it’s really hard to quantify my performance like sure 3000 tickets solved but u don’t know what portion of them were full blown features what portion was just a one liner.2
Senior Recruiters: Are GCP accreditations worth it? I’m looking to take the Professional Cloud Developer course.
Do they give weight on a CV?9
Should I point out on an interview, that I've been approached by other companies too? will that help me or not? what do you think?1
Seems like the company is going through some trouble. The sheer anxiety of having to deal with recruiters and interviews if it kicks the bucket gives me the shivers. Made me force myself into overtime.3
I wonder do HR in every companies or recruiters have a website where they create a profile of you and reviewing the good and bad about you.
So this recruiter from AWS reached out to me for a SDE job. I said yes I’m interested and scheduled an interview. She didn’t show up. I politely said would you like to schedule another time 30 min after the empty session was over. She said yes. Then the day after she sends me a message saying they can’t hire students. (I’m 20 yo second year electrical engineering student but I have decent dev experience ~3-4 years) I tell her I’m not planning on continuing with my 3rd year next fall. She says no I’m hiring from the “industry only”. And I try to tell her I’ve never had an internship before and all of this work experience is all by myself and not university related….she stopped responding…..what am I supposed to do? It’s not the first time that this has happened. They see “graduating 2024” they immediately bounce. I tried hiding what year my university education starts/ends….didn’t work…5
Join and Smart Recruiters is really trying very hard to overtake Workday as the worst job application platform.
Join has the effrontery to send me reminder emails to fill in the same details already contained in the resume I uploaded. What the fuck is wrong with these people?1
Topic: self promotion to get a job as developer in the tech
- CV short with bullet points or include also a brief description of experiences, skills in action and personal attitudes?
- Website? GitHub page? Suggestions about what highlight in personal git repos?
- Other things that could help to let you be noted in the pre-screening process of the recruiters?5